Speed, Energy & Penetration | Waterfowl Ammo | Shotgunning Series pt 7

How to publish a game on steam for freehow to delete steam games from pc DUCK SEASON should I shoot 1700 feet per second ammo or is 1500 good enough whats the minimum penetration in ballistic gel needed to ensure lethality how many foot pounds of energy are required for a pellet to kill a duck all excellent questions answers today Im Joel Strickland and this is part seven of my shotgunning Series right here on survive and duck season thanks for watching now there are a lot of misunderstandings assumptions and untruths that are rampant in the shotgunning world many are created by people who have an agenda or companies trying to sell us products still others are made by well-meaning people who just use false logic or an experience that they think they had and attribute that to the truth then it gets passed on before you know it everyone believes it today were talking about some of that up first speed kills this is the Mantra of the shot shell industry and has been for decades today muzzle velocity is a 1400 feet per second seems kind of slow more common are speeds of 15 16 and 1700 feet per second at the muzzle they whoever they is have told us that its necessary to shoot faster to kill Ducks especially with steel they also promote it as if it were a fact that its important to shoot faster so you can decrease your lead when you shoot so is all of that true does speed kill lets look at what happens to the shot as it flies downrange I recently used a high-speed camera to shoot video of the shot string seen on previous videos now we learned lots of other information from using the same technology and one of those things was discovering the true speed of pellets as they flew in front of the camera and we also use accurately measured background markers on the black and white backgrounds taken into consideration the force perspective with the center mass of pellets being approximately 36 inches from the background time is known to the exact frame because the technology tells us that to double check our findings I ran the calculations also at the muzzle where I could verify the speed from both the manufacturers muzzle velocity printed on the box and my own chronograph readings which were almost the same so heres the results from some of our testing the velocity of Steel slows more than that of denser Metals but also the faster you start the quicker it slows for example this load of number four steel is 1500 feet per second at the muzzle its 664 feet per second at 40 yards losing 56 percent of its speed if we look at the 1400 foot per second muzzle velocity on the number four steel we see that it only loses 20 feet per second at 40 yards not much difference lets look at some other loads for comparison heres the Winchester bismuth number four it has a muzzle velocity of 1450 feet per second at 40 yards its 7 45 about 50 percent loss in speed but 81 feet per second faster than the steel when we look at number four boss copper plated bismuth shot at 1350 feet per second we see that its terminal velocity at 40 yards is 7 17. thats only a 47 loss in speed and only 28 feet per second slower than the Winchester bismuth and 53 feet per second faster than the steel number fours with the muzzle velocity of 1500 feet per second so you can see the difference in all of that its very minuscule to shoot faster now its also worth mentioning that often the higher velocity shells have more recoiler felt recoil that Winchester bismuth for example its really tough on the felt recoil like not at all fun to shoot um lets add a steel number two to the comparison this number two steel that starts out at 1500 feet per second is 724 at 40 yards more than half of its speed is lost but this 1400 feet per second number two steel is 707 at 40 yards which is actually under 50 speed loss and a negligible difference in speed between the faster steel or either of the Bismuth loads so why does it matter patterning if youve been watching my other videos you know how much I talk about that Wing shooting is all about pattern in most of the pattern testing when I compare different muzzle velocities the slower load wins the pattern game so if its about pattern then you need to forget about the speed kills marketing baloney because it doesnt oh one more thing on speed many guys claim that they need to retrain themselves to shoot when they go with a different speed or different ammo well obviously knowing all of this information that I just shared with you kind of blows that idea out of the water youre talking about maybe an inch or two indifference in lead well what about TSS lets look at that this is Apex number eight at 1500 feet per second at the muzzle but at 40 yards its 898 feet per second remember its number eight so its very very small but it only loses 40 percent of its speed at that distance due to the fact that its 18 gram density shot now in this case you will see a difference in at least a foot in your lead at 40 yards compared to other shells and definitely more the further you shoot I wanted to take just a second to let you guys know how much I appreciate you watching these videos and being supportive of what Im doing here from time to time I have shirts and caps and other things for sale on the website if you want to help me make more videos like this one a great way to do that is pick up a cool piece of merch to show your support if youre watching this video in the fall or winter of 2022 I have quarter zip hoodies just like this one for sale theyre very high quality sporting the surviving duck season logo I appreciate your support you can find them at also theres a link in the description part of this video so speed doesnt kill we know that but speed does factor into kinetic energy some call it pellet energy or strike energy its all the same many foot pounds does it take to kill a duck thats a common question that I hear their assumption is that there is an exact value of energy that a pellet needs to deliver to kill a duck theres not not one minimum number that would cover every size and type of pellet now on the last video I did a lot of calculations and many of you appreciated that youve also asked for me to give you more including those for kinetic energy yeah I wanted to know too knowing the kinetic energy of a pellet is not hard but theres a lot more to lethality than just kinetic energy and thats a fact but arriving at a definitive answer in an equation so we can calculate for lethality thats where I got lost weeks in making this video too many variables and no exacts that can be worked out oh theres a few experts who believe there is but those experts dont agree with one another on how to do that then theres other experts who say theres no definitive way for you or I to factor for lethality so you see my problem too many experts in my research for this series Ive read published papers from scientific studies many articles a few books Ive also spoken with many shotgun shot shell and Ballistic experts and even consulted with a nuclear engineer and a published professor of mathematics and statistics yes theres lots of equations and other things that go well past kinetic energy we see terms like sectional density ballistic coefficient penetration and for days I was working out equations to the point that my mind was melting I finally had to stop and ask myself how many people care or would even try to work this stuff out for themselves I expect theres probably three of you Edward Lowry was a highly respected shot shell bellstition during the 20th century and he was the research director at Winchester Western and participated in several groundbreaking studies in the 1960s and 70s he published a lot from that research heres one of the many conclusions that he came to if two pellets deposited the same amount of lethal energy the smaller ones energy is more lethally effective basically the smaller pellet has an easier time penetrating and therefore its more lethally effective the bigger the pellet the more energy is needed for it to penetrate and make it lethally effective thats really good to know one thing that Lowry helped to develop from his research is a ballistic calculator that was a windows-based program its been many years ago and its no longer available today there have also been other programs developed over the past 20 years that claim to do the same thing essentially you input what type of load you shoot and a few other variables and the calculator tells you what happens at multiple distances like downrange velocity kinetic energy time of flight one particular program kpy ballistic calculator also tells you how much penetration in ballistic gel you could expect to get with your desired range well that sounds too good to be true unfortunately you cant get that program anymore either Ive tried now the kpy calculators gel penetration results are based on the assumption that 1.5 inches of penetration in ballistic gel is lethal for a pellet to kill a duck provided that it hits the duck in the right spot 2.25 inches for a goose I have no idea where they get this from as far as I can tell there are no scientific studies that substantiate that so I dont know if its right or not Ive had some experts say that yes it is and then some that say no Ive seen some people posting online in different groups of the results that they got using the kpy calculator I was curious for myself so I took some of the lows that the guys posted about knowing the penetration that they said they would get from using the calculator and then I shot the same load into ballistic gelatin to see if Id get the same penetration and you know what it was completely different I mean like every single shot was double-ish if they said 1.5 inches Id get three inches now I do know a little bit about ballistic gel Ive been buying the 10 gel because its the most accepted medium for testing hunting ammo but something wasnt right so I called clear ballistics the people who make the stuff and talked with the owner it was a very interesting conversation and I learned a lot about ballistic gel now before 1986 ballistic gel was kind of all over the place as far as a standard goes people made their own ballistic gel which was organic and had to be kept cool and it was always suspect of not providing accurate comparable results between batches in 1986 the FBI saw the need for a proper testing medium that they could use that would accurately and consistently show results comparable with shooting into flesh the result is what we use today called 10 FBI ballistic gel now the most recent products available is synthetic and doesnt need to be kept refrigerated theres also a 20 gel that they make thats used by the military and NATO its used for higher velocity ammo and ammo full metal jacket that sort of thing clear ballistics told me that theres a very small amount of the 20 percent sold and most of that is sold in Europe almost all the jails sold in North America is the 10 gel and thats what they recommend for hunting ammunition tests I did find out later that the kpy calculator was using 20 gel as their standard which is fine except if youre shooting gel testing your results and not using the 20 gel your numbers will be wrong also it seems to me that because of this standard of 1.5 minimum inches of penetration floating around that may or may not be true and the majority of guys who are buying 10 ballistic gel they may think that the 1.5 inches of penetration would be enough which it wouldnt heres the thing to know about ballistic gel it looks cool its interesting to see but ballistic gel is not alive it doesnt bleed it doesnt have skin feathers on it and it doesnt have bones you cant kill it so that means you really cant truly compare your shots and gel with shots in a live duck but can you use it to determine penetration comparing different ammunition I asked a few experts that again some said yes and some said no one of the expert ballistic researchers that I spoke with told me that ballistic calculators on the Internet or computer programs predicting what a pellet would do at a distance or using ballistic jelly was all ridiculous and invalid he pointed me to a lethality chart that was online its copyrighted and although it would be considered fair use for me to use it Im electing not to put it on this video but you can easily look it up by typing in Google non-toxic lethality table now this expert told me that its the only valid guide that would tell you for sure if a load would be lethal at a certain distance well the problem is its vague the chart was developed with empirical data thousands of live shot Mallards thats thats awesome but except for testing heavy shot the largest part of the testing on waterfowl was done before 1990. and on the table that Im talking about we only see suggestions for steel and heavy shot what about everything else tungsten Alloys theres a bunch of them TSS and bismuth the chart was created in 2012 and re-released in 2016. many more shot options have been made available since then so I asked him what if I took a number two steel that the chart says is lethal at 45 yards and then shoot it into ballistic gel and then shoot others in the same gel at the same distance to see how they compare if any of the other loads were equal to or exceeded that one it should kill a duck right his response was thats ridiculous its not scientific and it cant possibly predict lethality I asked other experts the same question and they said if you have a known lethal load you can certainly use ballistic gel to compare it with others its Apples to Apples Im not interested in performing a scientific study to be published Id just like to know what a shot shell made after 2011 looks like compared to a known lethal load theres new technology new pellet types and shapes new Composites and I want to compare them before I shoot them at a duck the problem I have with that table and really all the other tables you know the things on the side of a shotgun shell box while they do offer some suggestions all we get is multiple sizes offered as good or lethal for example large Ducks over decoys you can use steel shot from number twos through number sixes from 20 to 45 yards heavy shot fours to sixes at the same distance but I can tell you that steel number sixes are not your 45 yard loads that is ridiculous and the charts are vague I do believe there is some real value to this table though and that is giving recommendations to the minimum number of pellet hits in a 30 inch circle to ensure lethality I look for at least 90 hits for my personal patterning Ill get more into that on my next video the bottom line on this is there may be a few of you like me who wants to test out everything and get into the weeds but for the rest of you its not necessary to do anything more than pattern your gun the charts and tables that we discussed vague as they are are still a good starting point at least and you dont have to do all the gel tests or equations like Ive done to figure out lethality but it is interesting I do believe gel can be useful if used in the right way and comparing different shells Ill continue using 10 ballistic gel testing different ammo I dont feel confident though that the penetration depth of 1.5 inches or 3 inches or really anything is going to be a very accurate standard but if you do please remember that the 10 gel is going to give you double penetration if youre using that 1.5 inch minimum standard so what do you think about using ballistic gel to compare a known lethal load versus one in question let me know down in the comments so how do you know which pellet load and even length of shell to use on my next video it settles it all out if you want to know whats best for you thats going to be the video that will help you dial it in God bless you Im Joel Strickland and Ill see you there diablo game steam Get Surviving Duck Season 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T-Shirts and Hoodies available today! Does Speed Kill? How many foot-pounds of energy are needed to kill a duck? What about using ballistic gel? We dive into these topics today. Please check us out on instagram and Facebook too! Joel Strickland is a lifelong waterfowler, duck hunting guide and producer/director in the film and television industry. Thanks for checking out this video! If you enjoyed it, please give us a like and subscribe to this channel. Surviving Duck Season is a first of its kind waterfowling YouTube Channel. Our team is comprised of individuals from across the country who hunt every day of duck season. The waterfowlers lifestyle is more than just duck hunting, and on our channel we have lots of different types of content: Duck and goose hunting videos, cooking, DIY projects, reviews and suggestions on products and gear, and of course lots of tips and tactics. 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